Suzanne ,
Re your comment:
> *sigh* No I feel like I'm the one being taken out
> of context. I offered a defense of one specific
> story with one specific scenario that I felt had
> value, and does not represent such an enormous
> leap that writing it requires that all characters
> become someone else.
In fact, I think that non-Canon pairings and characterizations that aren't true to Austen are two separate issues.
I can see (and have read) scenarios in which Austen's characters might wind up with people other than the ones Austen destines them for, and still be true to Austen's characterization.
And I can see (and have read) scenarios in which Austen's characters wound up with the people Austen directed, yet were untrue Austen's characterizations.
So those are really two different issues.
But you said, specifically, "I myself wrote a book about a scenario I think never could have actually happened with the characters as written by Austen (that is, Elizabeth accepting Darcy's first proposal) [italics mine], but to just leave it at that is to leave the question unanswered, the story untold."
So you raised the issue.
Now I don't necessarily agree that Lizzy, if she was true to Austen's characterization, would never accept the Hunsford proposal. It depends on the surrounding circumstances. What if she got word that her dad died? What if Parson Bill reminded her once again, that very day, that the likelihood of any man ever again offering for her, despite her manifest charms, was highly unlikely, and she was feeling really insecure? What if she and the colonel never had the conversation about Jane, but did have a revealing conversation about Wickham? In my opinion, these all materially change the surrounding circumstances in a way that might lead to Lizzy, as Austen created her, seriously considering, perhaps even accepting, Darcy's proposal.
But you raised the issue, so I asked the question. Why use the Austen's characters, if you're not going to use Austen's characterization?
> The fact that Anne was not
> interested in Charles in the original was not, to
> me, enough in and of itself to prove that it
> couldn't be done in a way that was persuasive and
> interesting and also respectful to the book and
> the characters. That doesn't mean that I have no
> standards or opinions about what I like in
> fan-fiction or that I think fan-fiction isn't
> supposed to have any relationship at all to the
> original. But there are few scenarios (some, but
> not many), especially ones that are direct
> offshoots of the book, that I think are not even
> worth the attempt to explore. If it's done
> thoughtfully, if it's done carefully, with
> attention to characterization, almost anything can
> provide fresh insight to both the characters and
> to the story for those who care to read it. This
> one certainly did, for me at least.
And again, I don't think it's necessarily untrue to Austen's characterization of Anne to have her wind up with Charles. I don't like that scenario (the original issue raised by Nikki), but I can conceive of situations that might lead her to such a fate. But if she, for example, accepted Charles, while still having hope that Frederick might return and once again propose, that, to me would violate Austen's characterization, a whole other issue, but one you raised, unless I misunderstood you.
JIM
Re your comment:
> *sigh* No I feel like I'm the one being taken out
> of context. I offered a defense of one specific
> story with one specific scenario that I felt had
> value, and does not represent such an enormous
> leap that writing it requires that all characters
> become someone else.
In fact, I think that non-Canon pairings and characterizations that aren't true to Austen are two separate issues.
I can see (and have read) scenarios in which Austen's characters might wind up with people other than the ones Austen destines them for, and still be true to Austen's characterization.
And I can see (and have read) scenarios in which Austen's characters wound up with the people Austen directed, yet were untrue Austen's characterizations.
So those are really two different issues.
But you said, specifically, "I myself wrote a book about a scenario I think never could have actually happened with the characters as written by Austen (that is, Elizabeth accepting Darcy's first proposal) [italics mine], but to just leave it at that is to leave the question unanswered, the story untold."
So you raised the issue.
Now I don't necessarily agree that Lizzy, if she was true to Austen's characterization, would never accept the Hunsford proposal. It depends on the surrounding circumstances. What if she got word that her dad died? What if Parson Bill reminded her once again, that very day, that the likelihood of any man ever again offering for her, despite her manifest charms, was highly unlikely, and she was feeling really insecure? What if she and the colonel never had the conversation about Jane, but did have a revealing conversation about Wickham? In my opinion, these all materially change the surrounding circumstances in a way that might lead to Lizzy, as Austen created her, seriously considering, perhaps even accepting, Darcy's proposal.
But you raised the issue, so I asked the question. Why use the Austen's characters, if you're not going to use Austen's characterization?
> The fact that Anne was not
> interested in Charles in the original was not, to
> me, enough in and of itself to prove that it
> couldn't be done in a way that was persuasive and
> interesting and also respectful to the book and
> the characters. That doesn't mean that I have no
> standards or opinions about what I like in
> fan-fiction or that I think fan-fiction isn't
> supposed to have any relationship at all to the
> original. But there are few scenarios (some, but
> not many), especially ones that are direct
> offshoots of the book, that I think are not even
> worth the attempt to explore. If it's done
> thoughtfully, if it's done carefully, with
> attention to characterization, almost anything can
> provide fresh insight to both the characters and
> to the story for those who care to read it. This
> one certainly did, for me at least.
And again, I don't think it's necessarily untrue to Austen's characterization of Anne to have her wind up with Charles. I don't like that scenario (the original issue raised by Nikki), but I can conceive of situations that might lead her to such a fate. But if she, for example, accepted Charles, while still having hope that Frederick might return and once again propose, that, to me would violate Austen's characterization, a whole other issue, but one you raised, unless I misunderstood you.
JIM